STOI: Has Natwar Singh put Sonia Gandhi and Rahul Gandhi in the dock by his disclosures?
I think this is very distasteful. Nobody is put in the dock. These are innocuous personal conversations, impressions, information that somebody has access to because of their personal relationship with the Congress leader. And Natwar Singh has obviously had much greater access than anyone else can hope to have. This amounts to a betrayal of sorts. I have respected him enormously, I have known him, profited from conversations with him, an erudite person, a great admirer of Nehruji, Indiraji and Soniaji. I don't know what is the reason for him to have felt the urge to do this. I think it is not something that one can appreciate or one can accept.
Is the book Natwar's revenge for 'letting him down' in the oil-for-food scam in Iraq?
It may be something concerning that, but all of us work for the party... periodically step aside or make a sacrifice because the cause of the party and government that we serve is much larger than our personal cause and if there is personal vindication required, it comes. Our leaders are caring. And our leaders find appropriate ways of ensuring that our personal honour is vindicated if there is something that happened that is undeservingly imposed upon us. It happens in public life. For somebody who has received so much affection, support and opportunity from the leader to have to step aside momentarily and feel bad about it, I think (it) is really an exaggerated reaction. I am really saddened by this, best to put it behind us as soon as we can.
READ ALSO: Rahul told Sonia not to accept PM post, Natwar Singh says
Natwar says Rahul Gandhi stopped Sonia from becoming PM, is this true?
I have no idea what discussions happened within the confines of the family (and it) is not for us to delve into. When someone takes a decision, a lot of factors go into the decision. It is not necessarily one single factor alone... there are many factors. We go by the publicly stated position of Soniaji. It was a profound, noble gesture. There could have been many personal and many subjective considerations, it is not something you judiciously and objectively weigh and pronounce a judgment upon. I don't think it is fair in these circumstances.
Do you feel that if Sonia Gandhi had become prime minister the Congress would have been better off?
Well, we were supporting her to become prime minister at that time; we were out on the streets at that time. I remember, we were all sitting in dharna, till she called us and said no. The decision was final. So we accepted it. But there were a large number of people in the Congress who felt that she should accept prime ministership. The issue that had been raised by the opposition had been finally settled by the election results. We felt she should have become prime minister. She took a noble and a very patriotic decision and obviously she was our leader and we had to accept it.
Would Sonia have done a better job as prime minister than Manmohan Singh?
Obviously, she (Sonia) is our top leader. But it was her decision not to take the mantle. It is not a question, but it is her choice and we respect her choice. This is the best we could have given and it was seen in the results of the elections five years later when we got an endorsement of the people. We have lost now, but we will fight back. Sonia is our top leader and she was also leader of Dr Manmohan Singh. She has given all support to him when he was prime minister and books written by Sanjaya Baru and Natwar Singh are a disservice.
In the 410-page book by Natwar Singh, he referred to Manmohan Singh meeting Volcker and that he said something to Volcker and hence he was in trouble?
He has spoken about the Volcker report. I am not privy to what might have happened. Volcker was probably an important person in the UN system. And if he was looking at something that related directly or indirectly to India's support of the relief efforts that UN was engaging in then he would obviously meet at the highest level in the country. But I can't imagine that conversation would have anything to do to put the blame on Natwar Singh or anybody else. The report should be treated for whatever it is at face value. He may have disagreement with the report but I think the way you disagree with any report is the way to question that and to show how it is wrong rather than put the blame on any third person.
Former foreign minister Natwar Singh.
He has said Sonia and her son are responsible for the debacle of 2014. Your comments?
Is it fair for him to say that when his own son is in the BJP?
You don't agree that Sonia and Rahul are responsible..?
They are our leaders. All of us get together and say that they are to blame and we don't take any blame. The whole party has lost. They have themselves generously come and said that we led you and therefore we take the blame. The party said no. This is a time of crisis, you lead us through this crisis. We have lost because of a host of reasons. We have lost despite having an outstanding leadership like yours. We will now fight back with your leadership, we will fight back to gain the ground we have lost. What the party says in one voice can't really be put aside, because one person whose son is not in the Congress party is taking a different position. He wants to take a position, let him take the position.
READ ALSO: The Nehru-Gandhi dynasty is on the brink: Natwar Singh
Natwar Singh has talked about Sonia being ruthless, that she is alien, an Indian would not have treated him the same way? A Nehru, Indira or Rajiv Gandhi would not have treated him the same way. Has the revelation affected the Congress?
It has affected him, but why the Congress? He used to spend an hour or two every evening (with her)... he was the one who was seen as the major communication (channel) with her for anything that was happening in the world. He was a very close adviser to her. So this is a bit late in coming and late wisdom. Somebody you work so closely with you know there and then what kind of person they are. I think it is unfair, unfair in the extreme, for someone who has benefitted so closely from the Nehru family to say this. I feel really sad.
He has also said that Sonia is dictatorial, authoritarian ...?
He is wrong, she is an outstanding leader. We respect her, we all owe a lot to her. Even if we had any reason at any moment in life to be disappointed, we should look at the large things she has done for us, and I think as sensible civilized people we should acknowledge and recognize this even if we feel at any stage in some way disappointed or distressed. This is what we have learned from Natwar Singh. Today it is really awkward to be saying this about him.
Do you think the he was guilty as claimed by the Volcker report?
I have no idea. I have not read the report.
But later on you were foreign minister?
No, no; when I was foreign minister, the report didn't come to me. During my period this didn't happen. I have no idea.
"He (Rahul) wants to take a position, let him take the position."
But you would have been privy to the file nothings?
No, no. When you go into the ministry, you don't open every file... something that happened about 10 years ago and you want to see that file, unless you have some special interest. I have no personal idea of what happened in the Volcker report except like I am talking about Natwar Singh's book and I have talked about the Volcker report that was reported in the media. I have no reasons to know one way or the other. If he had something to say he should have said it to the Congress president. He should have argued his case and established that whatever was said in the Volcker report was wrong. I wish he had done it.
That is what he said before he returned from Frankfurt... that he was not even allowed to explain his stand?
Explain his stand means what? There was so much pressure in the country at that time. You have to think of the party first, the country, and then yourself. You can't think of the party and the country after you have thought of yourself. Whatever happened, in those circumstances it was important to take a decision. A decision would have been taken. But he had all the time in the world to explain. Has he now explained? Has he explained in the book? I don't know if he has.
He has indicated that the decision was hurried because he was too close to Sonia Gandhi and then fingers may point at Sonia Gandhi?
That is right. If you are close to your leader. If you are far away from your leader then there is no problem, but if you are close to your leader, what perceptions get created and therefore you have to do damage control. You can't allow if something happens and if I am seen as close to my leader, I must be dispensed with because we need to protect our leader. What are leaders there for? Leaders have to be protected, in the faith and confidence that if you are right your leader will turn around and protect you as well. If it is a choice between you and your leader, your leader must be protected first and your duty becomes to protect your leader.
Natwar Singh has said that Sonia and Priyanka went to meet him on May 5 and 6... why did they meet him?
I have no idea. After he distanced (himself), I have met him on several occasions, I was civil to him, I was courteous to him because I have known him for such a long time. So have they (Sonia and Priyanka) known him for such a long time. If they were showing some courtesies and some attempt to reach out to him, I think that should have been appreciated, instead of having been displayed in this manner. I think it is a breach of confidence to be writing about all this.
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